Difference between revisions of "User talk:Oknazevad"

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(Created page with "== Retro-bit rotation system == I wanted to talk about your edit of the rotation system for the retro-bit. I know there's no page for BPS rotation, as of Super Tetris 3, i...")
 
 
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And thanks for your contributions today, very good stuff! :) --[[User:Simonlc|simonlc]] ([[User talk:Simonlc|talk]]) 16:31, 17 October 2020 (UTC)
 
And thanks for your contributions today, very good stuff! :) --[[User:Simonlc|simonlc]] ([[User talk:Simonlc|talk]]) 16:31, 17 October 2020 (UTC)
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:In playing it on my friend's unit (I haven't gotten it yet myself) I gave a quick count to the block order and found that it does follow the bag concept. The lack of hold is definitely a Non-guideline-compliant element. It does allow for T-spins, though, so it may be that it's best described as partly compliant. I just find it fascinating that they used what is essentially a new NES version (as the system uses NES-on-a-chip hardware) instead of just using the BPS Famicom ROM  that so many other retro multi game units use. [[User:Oknazevad|Oknazevad]] ([[User talk:Oknazevad|talk]]) 22:19, 17 October 2020 (UTC)
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:Also, as someone noted in the comments on the YouTube video that's linked in the article, the lack of a hold function may be considered a hardware limitation, as there's no button that could be used to send a piece to a hold, with Select already being used for the Next on/off function, and A & B being clockwise and counterclockwise rotation respectively. Since any guideline element is a subject to hardware limitations, perhaps this version is considered as compliant as could be for the hardware. [[User:Oknazevad|Oknazevad]] ([[User talk:Oknazevad|talk]]) 22:43, 17 October 2020 (UTC)
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::T-spins are definitely possible, though it's not a good identifier for SRS alone. Simple T-doubles are possible in games with no kicks, such as NES Tetris, as it's natural rotation allows for it to rotate freely in a T slot. SRS simply allows for more complex spins, variations that allow T-spins via a kick. One such variation is a T-spin triple, in official games, it's only seen in games with SRS. I've verified my version and there are no kicks, so it is essentially identical to the Super Tetris 3 rotation system, minus the bug with S and Z pieces. I also tested the randomizer, it does seem to hand out pieces very evenly, I did get the impression it was bag at first, but it quickly fell apart and the pieces were appearing outside of possible bag order. I then started a second game, and the first two pieces were T-pieces. This would not be possible with a bag randomizer. I did speak with the developer of this game at one point. One of the things he mentioned was that TTC wanted a lot of last minute changes to be closer to guideline. It's very possible there are various versions of the game, and your friend's is different. I'd love to know more if you're able to confirm your findings. --[[User:Simonlc|simonlc]] ([[User talk:Simonlc|talk]]) 23:47, 17 October 2020 (UTC)
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:::Strikes me that we have the answer in you comment already. Shiru probably had a homebrew version in the vein of the old NES & Famicom versions (it shows elements of all three) that he'd previously worked on and when RetroBit/MyArcade contacted him about making it a licensed version to use in their handheld he had to make adjustments to bring it closer to compliance with the current standard but they weren't too picky as long as it works and isn't buggy. It's still really cool that it's now an official 4th version for the NES/Famicom, though I still wonder why they would bother with a new version when TTC has had no issues with stamping the BPS Famicom version as an official game in recent releases like the AtGames Legends line. [[User:Oknazevad|Oknazevad]] ([[User talk:Oknazevad|talk]]) 00:29, 18 October 2020 (UTC)
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:::I analysed the piece sequence from the video a while back and concluded that the randomiser was most likely 4-history, like TGM. I couldn't conclusively tell if it was 4 rolls or 6 rolls due to the small sample size. I think a video of Oknazevad's version might help for us to compare them. [[User:Arcorann|Arcorann]] ([[User talk:Arcorann|talk]]) 08:13, 19 October 2020 (UTC)
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::::I wouldn't know how to capture a video. Especially since, again, I don't actually have the handheld, just played it at my buddy Fred's house. And, as an aside, he's in the process of moving, so it'll be a while before I get to his again, so even if I were to buy my own. Which, to be honest, I'm not really inclined to just for the one game. I've either already got the other featured games, or am not interested in them, and the filler is junk. Maybe if the price comes down at some future point. [[User:Oknazevad|Oknazevad]] ([[User talk:Oknazevad|talk]]) 10:12, 19 October 2020 (UTC)

Latest revision as of 10:12, 19 October 2020

Retro-bit rotation system

I wanted to talk about your edit of the rotation system for the retro-bit. I know there's no page for BPS rotation, as of Super Tetris 3, it's basically SRS with no kicks. If I recall correctly, my version does not have kicks, I was wondering if yours did? I know there are different versions of the rom, but as far as I know the only thing that changed was the removal of the hard drop function. In terms of it being guideline or not, I'm not sure, it's lacking a lot of things like scoring, hold, bag randomizer, etc. I would prefer to say it's closer to a classic version of Tetris with a few guideline rules.

And thanks for your contributions today, very good stuff! :) --simonlc (talk) 16:31, 17 October 2020 (UTC)

In playing it on my friend's unit (I haven't gotten it yet myself) I gave a quick count to the block order and found that it does follow the bag concept. The lack of hold is definitely a Non-guideline-compliant element. It does allow for T-spins, though, so it may be that it's best described as partly compliant. I just find it fascinating that they used what is essentially a new NES version (as the system uses NES-on-a-chip hardware) instead of just using the BPS Famicom ROM that so many other retro multi game units use. Oknazevad (talk) 22:19, 17 October 2020 (UTC)
Also, as someone noted in the comments on the YouTube video that's linked in the article, the lack of a hold function may be considered a hardware limitation, as there's no button that could be used to send a piece to a hold, with Select already being used for the Next on/off function, and A & B being clockwise and counterclockwise rotation respectively. Since any guideline element is a subject to hardware limitations, perhaps this version is considered as compliant as could be for the hardware. Oknazevad (talk) 22:43, 17 October 2020 (UTC)
T-spins are definitely possible, though it's not a good identifier for SRS alone. Simple T-doubles are possible in games with no kicks, such as NES Tetris, as it's natural rotation allows for it to rotate freely in a T slot. SRS simply allows for more complex spins, variations that allow T-spins via a kick. One such variation is a T-spin triple, in official games, it's only seen in games with SRS. I've verified my version and there are no kicks, so it is essentially identical to the Super Tetris 3 rotation system, minus the bug with S and Z pieces. I also tested the randomizer, it does seem to hand out pieces very evenly, I did get the impression it was bag at first, but it quickly fell apart and the pieces were appearing outside of possible bag order. I then started a second game, and the first two pieces were T-pieces. This would not be possible with a bag randomizer. I did speak with the developer of this game at one point. One of the things he mentioned was that TTC wanted a lot of last minute changes to be closer to guideline. It's very possible there are various versions of the game, and your friend's is different. I'd love to know more if you're able to confirm your findings. --simonlc (talk) 23:47, 17 October 2020 (UTC)
Strikes me that we have the answer in you comment already. Shiru probably had a homebrew version in the vein of the old NES & Famicom versions (it shows elements of all three) that he'd previously worked on and when RetroBit/MyArcade contacted him about making it a licensed version to use in their handheld he had to make adjustments to bring it closer to compliance with the current standard but they weren't too picky as long as it works and isn't buggy. It's still really cool that it's now an official 4th version for the NES/Famicom, though I still wonder why they would bother with a new version when TTC has had no issues with stamping the BPS Famicom version as an official game in recent releases like the AtGames Legends line. Oknazevad (talk) 00:29, 18 October 2020 (UTC)
I analysed the piece sequence from the video a while back and concluded that the randomiser was most likely 4-history, like TGM. I couldn't conclusively tell if it was 4 rolls or 6 rolls due to the small sample size. I think a video of Oknazevad's version might help for us to compare them. Arcorann (talk) 08:13, 19 October 2020 (UTC)
I wouldn't know how to capture a video. Especially since, again, I don't actually have the handheld, just played it at my buddy Fred's house. And, as an aside, he's in the process of moving, so it'll be a while before I get to his again, so even if I were to buy my own. Which, to be honest, I'm not really inclined to just for the one game. I've either already got the other featured games, or am not interested in them, and the filler is junk. Maybe if the price comes down at some future point. Oknazevad (talk) 10:12, 19 October 2020 (UTC)